29. Tucker Anderson | DP | Founder of Element Filters
In this episode, Marshal speaks with Tucker Anderson, Cinematographer and Founder of Element Filters. Tucker shares his journey from humble beginnings in a small ski town to building a successful film career working in Vancouver and L.A. He reveals his unique approach to networking and landing clients, offers tips for building a portfolio from scratch, and how the pandemic and his search for better ND filters inspired him to create his own company, Element Filters.
Episode Highlights
2:11 How Tucker Started
9:54 Building a Portfolio from Scratch
12:34 Key Business Lessons
14:51 Client Outreach Processes and Systems
18:56 How to Stand Out
27:56 Cycle of Feast and Famine
30:12 Element Filters Explained
49:27 Advice to Newcomers
🔗 CONNECT WITH Tucker Anderson
📸 Instagram | www.instagram.com/tuckeranderson
📸 Instagram | www.instagram.com/elementfilters
💻 Website | www.tuckerkanderson.com
💻 Website | www.elementfilters.com
🔗 CONNECT WITH MARSHAL
📸 Instagram | www.instagram.com/marshalchupa
💻 Website | www.marshalchupa.com
👥 Linkedin | www.linkedin.com/in/marshal-chupa-99a7921a8
📄 SHOW NOTES & TRANSCRIPT
Visit the website for the transcript and highlights from the conversation - www.shotlistpodcast.com
🎙 ABOUT THE PODCAST
This podcast is all about helping emerging cinematographers, photographers, and directors navigate the challenges of making a life and a living behind the lens. From workflow to personal growth, creative vision to marketing, finances to production—every episode is packed with a wide range of topics to support visual storytellers in their pursuit of building a business and growing a career they are proud of.
🎧 LISTEN FOR FREE Apple Podcasts | https://podcasts.apple.com/ca/podcast/shotlist/id1645435800 Spotify | https://open.spotify.com/show/3m5203Y5yQ7wNXQhZBOmNV?si=f46bc0e937bf40c1
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📱 GET IN TOUCH
You can also drop me a DM instagram @marshalchupa or email marshal@marshalchupa.com
Transcript
Introduction and Welcome
The more people who know you, and the more relationships you can build, the better. Like getting coffee with somebody for an hour. That's all that could be. It might not lead to a job or whatever, but I see that as a valuable interaction, a, just for sake of getting to know more people in the industry, and you never know what you're going to learn from somebody, but b, just because if you spend that hour, ultimately the worst thing that's going to come from that is you're going to talk to somebody who has a mutual interest as you for an hour, which is interesting enough to spend a few bucks on a coffee for, in my opinion.
Hello, and welcome to another episode of the Shotless podcast, where we talk about how to make a life and a living behind the lens. I'm, um, cinematographer Marshall Chupa, and today I'm speaking with DP Tucker Anderson. In this episode, Tucker and I dive into his journey story of starting out in the action sports world, and how he kept the lights on while building a portfolio, how he finds work and stays top of mind as a commercial DP working both in Canada and the US. His journey story with starting the company element filters, speaking to both the hardships and the wins, and what it takes to make this career sustainable and work for a lifetime to come. I really enjoyed my conversation with Tucker, as I see we both have a similar brain when it comes to the work we create and put out into the world, and the entrepreneurial itch that wants to tirelessly make our skills and ideas into other business opportunities. I'm excited to share this conversation with you. Let's dive in. Tucker, thanks so much for coming on the shotless podcast. Excited to have you here.
Thank you so much for having me. I'm a fan of it. There's so much, such a wealth of knowledge on it, and I'm excited to be here.
How Tucker Started
Awesome. Yeah, so just, like, looking at. I, uh, was just digging through some of your online work this morning as a DP and saw, like, a kind of a mix of, like, commercial content, and there was even some short film stuff on there. But then, uh, you're also the founder of Element filters, so that's something I'm excited to dive into, uh, a little bit later on, but just to get an idea of how this all began for you, when did you get into camera work, and what was your journey like in the beginning?
Yeah, totally. So, uh, like a lot of people you've had on the podcast, I sort of started out in the action sport world. I grew up in the interior of BC, wherever that was the film industry, it was just action sports. So skiing, mountain biking, tourism videos, the whole outdoors scene. And sort of as a kid, once, you know, the skiing backflips turned from one rotation in the air to two. That felt like a good time to pick up a camera for me.
Okay, where did you grow up in interior BC?
Uh, I grew up in a small town called Nelson. It's a little ski town, very outdoors oriented, as I mentioned, and very beautiful. I miss it.
Yeah, yeah, yeah. I'm a Kamloops boy, so it's not too. Not too far off. So, okay, you're in this action sports world picking up a camera because, uh, yeah, obviously you're not hucking doubles. So how did that translate into making a living? Because it's all fun and games. We can chase our friends with cameras on the mountains. But where did things become serious?
Yeah, totally. Pretty much fresh out of high school, I had a dear friend who is working out in Vancouver in the sort of traditional Hollywood industry, if you will, um, on just bigger shows, union productions, where there's, you know, hundreds of people on set. And she was kind enough to get me a job as a production assistant, which is where a lot of people start in the film industry, I think. But what you don't realize before you go on those sets, particular, uh, sets of that skill, is that being a production assistant on those sets, particularly in Vancouver, just essentially translates to standing in the rain, watching a pile of gear to make sure nobody steals it for 15 hours a day. So the glamour of, you know, moving to the city and working in, you know, Hollywood productions wore off very quickly for me. And at that time. So I did that for, uh, roughly like three, four months. Lived in Vancouver. You know, I was pretty young at the time, like, 1819. And during that time, I got connected with this production company, uh, called Sherpa Cinema, based out of Whistler, BC, who, if you're at all familiar with the action sports film industry, you'd know of Sherpa cinema. They're very popular and their ski movies are quite legendary in the scene. And was fortunate enough to get in touch with them and get on this production called imagination, featuring Tom Wallace, professional skier. And just was a production assistant on that, which was a world of difference, uh, compared to the production assistant work I was doing on the big Hollywood sets. And that sort of segued into doing a longer form internship with them. And I moved up to Squamish and was working a lot at Whistler. And that was sort of what launched me more into the acting sports world and sort of got the ball rolling for me in a professional sense.
Okay, and then how long did you, did you actually work with sherpas for a while, or was that just an internship?
No. So I just did the internship. I think, uh, they kind of threw me into the post production end of things, which at the time, I was young and naive and just didn't want to be doing post. Um, and in hindsight, it was great experience, and they were very patient with me. And, um, Dave Mossop, who's one of the owners, was a great mentor in that sense, and would entertain the conversations where I would just tell him I wanted to shoot over and over without realizing that I was way too inexperienced for them to actually throw me into the field, understandably, in hindsight. Anyway, so that internship lasted again, I think three or four months. And then I moved back to Nelson and had a part time job at the local movie theater as a projectionist, which was a super fun job. And then was also kind of part time freelancing at the same time for some local clients, just doing, like, videography work, essentially, at the beginning.
Okay, so in the beginning, did you just have, like, a DSLR and you were going reaching out to small companies, or what was that stepping stone?
Totally. Exactly. I was on the DSLR train. Uh, when I left Sherpas, they kind of gave me this parting gift of, uh, this old Panasonic gh four they had, which at the time was like, I was so excited about that. Uh, a young version of me was just like, oh, that shoots 96 frames per second. And, like, you know, just very as excited as you would be as a young adult about that. And. Yeah, exactly. It was just pitching to local brands. Like, I think the first actual video I got paid for was with me and my older brother. He used to work at this zip line just outside of Nelson, and we shot this, like, promo video for them. And I think to this day, actually, it is still on their website. I checked a couple years ago, and they had still used it. And I watch it now, and I cringe, of course, as we all do at our old work. But it's just funny to me that it's lasted the test of time for them.
Humble beginnings, man. We all started. Yeah. So then how did you begin to get consistent work? Cause I think in the beginning, you know, that's a big step for a lot of people. Okay, you got a DSLR, start shooting for small companies, start learning the ropes. But, like, how at that point, you were doing, you know, you're, uh, doing a side hustle job. Like, what was the tipping point that allowed you to step into doing camera work full time?
Totally. I mean, it's a tricky thing, like, especially with freelancing, because at the beginning in particular, it's such a roller coaster, or it's so volatile. You know, you can have a ton of work one month and then it can be dry for the next. And I think that going the route of having a part time job was really smart. So essentially, I worked at the movie theater in conjunction with freelancing part time for about a year. And then during that time, I wasn't all in. Like, I was just on the fence about it. And I think there's something about, something to be said about, like, going all in that that forces you to have that work. Like, if there's no plan b or there's no part time job to fall back on, it sort of gives you a different mindset for it. And the long story short is I essentially went traveling to Southeast Asia and Australia. I was gone for, like, six months. And when I came back, I had, like, eight, uh, hundred bucks in my bank account, moved back in with my parents and was like, screw it. I'm going to go all in. And just forced myself to go full time as a freelancer, essentially, and have not looked back many years later now. So, no regrets.
Well, then how did that even happen? So you got $800 in your pocket, and, you know, how do you go all in? Like, how did you afford? Did you had a camera at that point still? Did you start, like, knocking on doors, uh, of businesses? Like, what what made you go all in?
Yeah, I think it was more to do than anything else. More to do with the mindset of it, of like, you know, taking that pause, taking that break. It's such a classic story of, like, going traveling to find yourself. And the only thing I could think about while I was traveling was just that I wanted to be shooting. And so, yeah, I still had the gh four. I think I, like, spent the rest of my money on a, uh, used Ronin when I got back, a little handheld gimbal. And fortunately, you know, I was in a very fortunate position where my family was happy to have me back at home and my parents weren't charging me rent. So that obviously really helps at the beginning of a career to not have to worry about, like, many overhead expenses. And, yeah, I was basically just, like, reaching out to every, anyone and everyone that I, that I could. Which in Nelson, it's you know, a, uh, small enough film community that you meet people pretty quick. And, yeah, it took a minute to get it off the ground. Like, it was not glorious at the start. It was, there was long periods of time where I just like, wouldn't have work. And, you know, it was more about just like, what can I shoot to learn things? What can I shoot to build my portfolio? And then, you know, whenever the paid jobs would come in, that would obviously be, yeah, pretty great and exciting at the time. So.
Building a Portfolio from Scratch
Mhm. How did you start building that portfolio? Were you showing these little pieces that you were filming or were you only showing like this action sports stuff you're shooting, probably for fun? Or how did you slowly build that portfolio that actually created, generated income, work, so to speak?
Yeah, I mean, at the beginning it was really anything and everything because I didn't have any examples of work. So, like, right at the beginning it was like, okay, whatever. Basically everything that I shot would end up on the portfolio. And a lot of it was just, uh, you know, reaching for some the most accessible, like low hanging fruit. Like, I would shoot real estate videos for like $250 for, you know, a local realtor. What? Like, whatever, it was like, I was just keen to shoot. And that to me, like, it was more about like doing the reps. And I think that's easy to say in hindsight. At the time, maybe I didn't think of it that way, but just to like, uh, get more clients under the belt and, you know, you're also learning how to run a business at the same time as learning how to run a camera and be creative. And I think that's like an important balance to be had and not always something people focus on, but like, that is part of it. And you have to learn how to like, charge clients and, you know, all the backend stuff that is equally as important as like, the skills behind the camera.
And in the beginning, like, so how did you start to build relationships? Because ultimately that's kind of the hardest part. You said, I mean, Nelson small, are you literally just sending emails to like, people you think would be fun to work with, or are you knocking on doors? Like, how did you, yeah, how did you begin to build relationships?
It was a bit of both, you know, sending cold emailing. I think having the internship at Sherpas Cinema really helped me in the beginning just because in communication, especially with people in the action sports world, like, everyone was familiar with Sherpas. And so me being able to say, hey, I, like, I just got off doing this internship with Sherpas or I just worked with Sherpas on such and such a project, really, really helped me in the beginning to be able to leverage, like, getting meetings with people in the action sports world. And that in conjunction with, you know, finding some peers in the space that were at a similar place to me or just a little bit further along than me, that could bring me on to shoot b camera for their clients. Or, you know, there's a couple friends, some of which I'm still friends with to this day, that really helped me out in the early stages and sort of showed me the ropes, which, uh, yeah, it's such an invaluable relationship to have.
Key Business Lessons
Okay. And in the beginning, what was the business part like for you? Okay. Like, you're just getting into this. Like, what were some of the biggest lessons? Maybe thinking back on the business side of getting things going that maybe stick.
Out, the one that comes to mind is just kind of funny in hindsight. Just figuring out how to charge clients, I think, was the hardest thing. Especially when you're starting out, it's really hard to know what your value is. And when you're new to the business, you're not familiar with the industry standards, nor are your skill sets at that place. And so there's a couple instances where I wouldn't have contracts in place, and then in post, the client would just keep asking for revisions of the edit, and it'd be this endless process where I was like, I don't know, at what point do I charge them more? Or then they would get mad because I was charging them more, and that wasn't communicated. And all those, uh, speed bumps, if you will, that at the beginning, you're just like, oh, I didn't think about this. And then what's great about it is you learn quickly, and you have that awkward interaction with the client, and then you learn what not to do on the next one. And I think that's, like, still to this day applies. Like, as you grow, you enter new leagues of scale and business, and there's always new things that you take away. And, like, I think I see myself doing this for the rest of my life, and I have a feeling that even 60 year old Tucker will still be learning things on every job. So.
Yeah, and I think that's the exciting part about what we do, is, like, it's just this never ending ladder of learning. And so, I don't know, working some typical nine to five where you just show up and you've got your skill, and you do your thing. Like, I don't know, my soul is not okay with that. And respect to people who, like, love to just plug in and do their thing and then eject and, you know, we can warrior and all that, but I don't know, there's just something so fulfilling about this, this journey that, like, you can never learn enough. Uh, whether that's the business side or, like, creatively. Like, you can never not, you can't just like, master lighting. I mean, you can map, you can somewhat master it, obviously, but, you know, there's always something to learn.
Absolutely.
A new camera technique or a new. And I think the way technology is evolving too, like, we gotta sit on our toes, man, because things are changing hot and quickly.
Oh, yeah.
I think being adaptable is such a huge part of this, so, yeah, 100%.
Couldn't agree more.
Client Outreach Processes and Systems
Yeah. Are there any, like, processes or systems you have in place, um, that have helped you, uh, over time, whether that's just like, keeping things going when it comes to reaching out to clients or staying, um, organized with gear or a pretty big nerd on that stuff. And I love to, I love knowing what other guys are doing if they do.
Totally. Yeah. I mean, nowadays it's a little different since I've niched specifically into Dping, into cinematography, where the approach is different, where I'm not reaching out to clients, I'm not pitching on jobs myself. So it's more about the relationships with producers and directors and building relationships. And I sort of go through phases where maybe once a quarter or every time I'm in a new city, I'll just reach out to hundreds of people. Like, I'm a self proclaimed animal when it comes to networking, especially when I arrive somewhere new, it's just like anyone and everyone that I can, you know, get a coffee with, like, I'm there. And I just see that as, like, spreading a wide net is like, the more people who know you and the more relationships you can build, the better. Like, getting coffee with somebody for an hour, that's all that that could be. You know, it might not lead to a job or whatever, but I see that as, as a valuable interaction, a, just for sake of getting to know more people in the industry. And I, you never know what you're going to learn from somebody, but b, just because if you spend that hour, ultimately the worst thing that's going to come from that is you're going to talk to somebody who has a mutual interest as you for an hour, which is interesting enough to spend a few bucks on a coffee for, in my opinion. So that's kind of my philosophy with it, but it definitely comes and goes and waves, and sometimes you're way too busy to have coffees. But I just got back up to Vancouver after a long stint in LA, and now I'm just reaching out to tons of people and yeah, it's fun. I like that aspect of the job.
Right, yeah, I think that's maybe something that it's cool to hear you're an animal with because I think a lot of, a lot of creatives are just introverts and they're just not into connecting and, yeah, kind of want to stay in their safe space and hope the phone rings. And I think that's just like something people need to hear as well. It's like, yeah, I like your wide net approach because ultimately it is, I feel like it's a numbers game from my experience as well, because sure you can meet some great people, but you never know when the opportunity for them is going to land. So, specifically as a DP or cinematographer, like you said, our connection is to directors and producers. We're kind of relying on when they happen to have an opportunity, which then trickles down to us. So this wider net, the more people, the more potential there is. And, um, I think like the top of mind thing, like you said, just get keeping in. You have to continually stay on top of keeping in touch with people because, I mean, I can't count the number of times where like, I'll just happen to go for a coffee with someone and then it's like within the, you know, the span of a few weeks to a month or something, I'll get a call, but because I'm top of mind, like, they could have called any DP, but I just happened to have reached out and the energy is still fresh. We had a good conversation. So is that kind of how you feel as well, or.
Absolutely, yeah, I mean, it's all about, yeah, like you said, it's like you could get called or not called just based on, you know, whether somebody thinks of you, which is a crazy thing to have to navigate, but, like, it's the truth of the matter. And like, any sort of way that you can maintain that top of mindness, you know, with people, like whether it's putting a director's birthday in your calendar, so you text them once a year, that's one extra reason to reach out. And that's not like from a, uh, you know, a disingenuous perspective. Like, of course you want to wish them a happy birthday. And the side effect of that is that now they, they think of you. You know what I mean? So it's, it's all those, like, uh, that's just one example, of course. But, but yeah, I mean, I look at it as like you spread a wide net and then you can kind of gauge from that, like, how well you connected with a certain person and what relationships are worth, like following up on and pursuing and, you know, but, uh, sort of assessing it after you've met a bunch of people. Yeah, that's a constant process.
How to Stand Out
Yeah. And when you, these people like what, let's say directors, producers, like, what are the things you find they're looking for when it comes to portfolio or just experience or just like good vibes. Like have, uh, you noticed anything specifically that they're, that you do maybe to, uh, stand out from the, or just make an impression?
Yeah, totally. I mean, I think it's really a lot of it is good vibes. Like people, especially with, you know, when you're on set together for 12 hours a day or whatever it is, people want to hang out with people that they get along with. And ultimately you become friends with people. And I think that that's a piece of advice I got early on in my career, was try to make friends with people. And the more you can connect on a personal level, on a human level, that's not only going to help you get hired, but also going to help you on set when you're communicating with that person, you know, how they think about the world, their perspective on things is going to help translate into those conversations about specific things, like, okay, what shot are we going to do? Where's the camera going to be, etcetera. I think that all trickles down and back to the relationship you're building with different directors and producers.
Yeah. When it comes to the work you're creating, how much of it is? Because I know for myself, a lot of the work I show is actually spec work. Um, that gets me work ironically. I'm curious, how much of what you're shooting and showing are you pushing, uh, your own projects, um, to have that ability to shape and push what's possible without a client looking over your shoulder? Or are you making director's cuts of the content that you're shooting for clients? Uh, how do you look at that?
Yeah, totally. I think spec work is a great way to do that, especially if you're trying to get into the commercial world. And it's a tricky balance, you know, because it's, it's often difficult to make spec work look real. I've definitely shot my fair share of it. There's still, you know, a few pieces on my portfolio that are. That are shot on spec. And I had a very fortunate opportunity where this ad agency out of Toronto that I've done some stuff with, um, over the years reached out to me a couple years ago and wanted to fund a few spec pieces. So that's been huge. And just in terms of, like, making them look like real commercials and therefore, like, more sellable, and it just helps build your portfolio. Uh, but absolutely. Like, I've done. I've done DP's cuts of things that were maybe I didn't like the director's cut, which, obviously, you have to have a really good relationship with your director to greenlight that. And that doesn't happen often, unfortunately, because most of the time, I love the people that I work with, and they're very talented. But, yeah, it's more about positioning yourself in the direction you want to go in, I think is more what that's about than, you know, the end product maybe not being good. It's more about, like, okay, what does this represent, and how is this gonna help me get more work in the direction that I want to head in as. As a, you know, cinematographer and as an artist? Really?
Yeah. Yeah. Ah. Because I think, I mean, something, at least the way I frame things, is, like, show the work you want to shoot, you know? So I think that's why a lot of I put out there is actually a lot of spec stuff, because ultimately, I want that genre to come back to me in a paid form. So I guess, how are you limiting your portfolio, uh, so to speak, in a selective way?
Yeah, I mean, I think that's super important to talk about, just because a lot of people don't realize how much you could look at somebody's instagram or somebody's website and just be, like, so awestruck by that and not realize that that's actually only 20% of what they're shooting. And I think that rings true for myself, for sure. Like, I still shoot a lot of just random things that are. That are just not the direction I want to head in. And it's not that the client's not happy with it. You know, if it's. It might just be, like, some corporate video that is a good day rate and, you know, you know what they say, like, one for the meal, one for the real. And how I like to look at that, it's like, sometimes you do stuff for the paycheck and you still put your all into that, but it might not be the best representation of the direction you want to go in or how you feel creatively. And so, yeah, absolutely. Like, it's, I'm super selective with what I end up posting. And, uh, yeah, it's tricky. Like, even debating, like, pulling older stuff off of social media or, like, you know, I don't think there's a right or wrong answer to that, but, you know, that's a constant debate and because, uh, essentially, like, people view you as your worst piece of work that's online, and so you have to be selective about, like, what is that and how many things do you want to show? Because if there's one that's like, you know, visibly worse than the rest, that's how they're going to think about you. No, they're not going to think about your best work, you know, so that's a tricky thing to navigate.
No, I agree. I feel like, and of course, we're so emotionally attached to the work we've created, so it's like, really hard to let go of. Like, let's say three years ago you created a piece and you put so much love and effort into it, but, like, now you've kind of outgrown that. And we're like, oh, my God, could I just make it disappear into the ether? Like, was it a, you know, but ultimately, that is a stepping stone. And I think it is important to think of ourselves as a brand because, like, whatever we're showing, new producer director shows up and they flick through your instagram, um, or they're on your website, and it's just the, it's like you only have such a limited time to make an impression. You know, people are busy people these days, and it's just like, how do you convey certain things really quickly who you are, the level of work you're shooting. You're right. If there is that, like, one piece that doesn't resonate still, I feel like the less is more is actually a better way to go about it than trying to just be like, hey, uh, look at all this work I've shot. I think it's the opposite, to be honest. It's like, here's like three to five banger pieces that are, like, really show my best possible side of me.
Yeah, 100% agree. And that, I think that translates into, like, demo reels, too. Like, oftentimes I'll watch a demo reel, and frankly, if it's more than a minute long, like, you know, directors and producers don't have time to watch the whole thing. They're getting bored, like. And you've already lost that job just from the time of it being too long, even if all the shots are really good. It's like. Yeah, it's a tricky thing to figure out, like, what is going to be the most bang for your buck in terms of, like. Yeah. Being selective about the stuff you post.
Yeah. And you mentioned, uh, you just came back from LA, so I think it's on your website. You're us and canadian citizen. Is that right?
Yeah, I got lucky.
I was gonna say you won the frickin lotto there, brother. That's.
Yeah, totally. I have a lot of. A lot of other DP's and directors, Canadians specifically, that get mad at me for that because I just got laughed.
At you for it.
Yeah. Entirely fair. Yeah, I just. I got lucky there where I was born in the US, and then my family moved to Canada when I was young, and so I got grandfathered into the canadian and us citizenship thing all before, you know, the age of ten, so I didn't have to worry about any of it. So that was, uh. Yeah, I'm putting it to use at least, you know, bouncing back and forth between LA and Vancouver, and so that's. Yeah, I feel like it'd be a shame not to.
Of course. Yeah. I mean, I feel like you're born to a cinematographer or DP. Just, uh, you know, I feel like that's such a huge hurdle so many of us are fighting these days, at least as canadian filmmakers, trying to figure out how to get us work visas and that whole rigmarole. But that's, like, beautiful that you had the ticket already in your back pocket. So. Good on you, Tucker.
Very. It's. Yeah, I mean, I. Again, I just got lucky, like, yeah, thanks to my family. Uh, I wish I could take credit for it, but. Yeah, exactly. Yeah, just. Just got lucky on that one. But definitely, like, I talked to a lot of people who are trying to go get an zero one artist visa, and it's not only time consuming, but it's expensive. You have to renew it every few years. It's thousands of dollars. Like, you gotta be. You gotta be working quite a bit in the US to make that worthwhile. Whereas for me, it's, you know, I just flash my passport and they welcome me home both ways, which is a pretty fortunate, uh, position to be in, for sure.
Okay, well, let's probably stop talking about that because we're pissing people off right now.
Yeah, don't come at me in the DM's after this.
Cycle of Feast and Famine
Well, let's dive a little bit into the mindset, um, around the freelance roller coaster because, I mean, you talked about a little bit in the beginning of your journey that like the feast and famine, like, life cycle of getting a lot of work and then getting no work. Like, how have you been able to break or how do I say, stay strong through the quiet, quiet times. And what has kept you going when you're like, you know, wanting to throw on the towel, so to speak?
Yeah, totally. I mean, I think staying strong is the, is the better phrase for it as well. I don't think. I, uh, you know, I think there's, it ebbs and flows for anybody all the way up the ladder and you're going to have busy times and you're going to have slow times. And especially last year in LA with the strikes that kind of trickled down to everyone at every tier of just a big slowdown and it was a bit of a funky year. And I think it's more just tolerance that you build up where at the beginning when you're freelancing and you don't have work for two weeks, you might freak out because the phone's not ringing. But the more years you have under your belt of doing this, the more you just get used to that and you plan for that financially. And, you know, there's all these things you can do to set yourself up to make it more of a smooth ride and less of a roller coaster that you're terrified to go down every drop, so to speak. So, yeah, uh, at this point, I don't get worried about it anymore. And, you know, in the lulls, I try to just enjoy the time that's slow because I know as soon as the phone rings, you know, when it rains, it pours and then you're working for three weeks straight without a break. So it's, you know, it's a tricky thing, but, yeah, it's not for everybody. I'll put it that way, 100%.
Are there specific things that have helped you with that? You know, you said, you just mentioned like savings and stuff like that, or do you have like other sources of income you've created to help bolster the quiet times or. Yeah. What are some of the, if anything, um, that come to mind to help in those moments?
Yeah, totally. I mean, from a DP perspective, I definitely just spend that time to reach out to new people. I think that, like, we talked about networking a little bit earlier, I think that's a great opportunity to do that, especially when it's slow all the way up the ladder. Like, I was able, while being in LA, to have meetings with people that typically would be super busy, but because of the strikes, they were willing to take time to sit down for a coffee. And it's more about like, the long term relationships on those. Like, they're not necessarily gonna hire me tomorrow, but years from now, you never know where that could go. So those connections are worth making when it's slow. And, and then you mentioned, yeah, other sources of income. And as you mentioned at the beginning of the podcast, I own a camera filter company called Element Filters, and that's been something that I've been able to pour a lot of time into, uh, amongst shoot, between shoots, and just when it's slow, um, that's generally what I'm chipping away at on the day to day, which has been its own big, long journey.
Element Filters Explained
Well, that's a perfect opportunity. Why don't we jump into that side of things? Because I'm curious to know, element filters, why, of all things, you could have chosen anything to dive into? Did you choose, uh, nd filters?
Yeah, great question. Essentially, I just wanted to buy a set of four by five nd filters for myself as a DP. That was one of many tools that was, it's an industry standard size for one, and it's something that you can sort of the buy once, cry once philosophy of like, you can buy it and you can use that, you know, for the rest of your career, because the standard hasn't changed in many, many years, and I don't see that changing anytime soon. And so I just wanted to buy a set of nds for myself. And at the time, uh, right as that sort of thought process was happening, the pandemic hit, and naturally I lost all my freelance gigs and wasn't about to spend more money on gear at that time. And I, in conjunction with that, I was doing a lot of research in that space, and didn't really like the cost to quality ratio at the time of what else was out there in the four x five nd space, particularly something that was color neutral, that blocked infrared light. I was shooting on a red camera. So some of those sensors struggle with that stuff, and they don't have internal nds for the most part. So that was sort of the catalyst and the perfect storm of it being the pandemic, and having a lot of time on my hands for me to dive down the rabbit hole of exploring, making my own, and a rabbit hole it definitely was.
So where does that rabbit hole even begin? Like, I mean, I, uh, don't know. I'm fascinated from an entrepreneurial perspective of just, like, how do you even begin to, like, create your first prototype to, like, you know, think about making in bulk? And, like, how did that whole process go?
Yeah, it's. I mean, I knew nothing about that world. Making a physical product is, is really hard. I wouldn't recommend it to anybody, frankly. It's, it's a, uh, I just kind of became, because I had the time, was able to go down the rabbit hole. And I don't think at a certain point I just got too far down it that I, you know, it made more sense to go through than backwards. So. But it's tricky. I mean, yeah. Finding a manufacturer that, that could do what I wanted them to do at the caliber that I wanted to do it, obviously, like with cinema tools, specifically with optics, you have to be very precise. And I, and I think that's, like, a tricky thing for a lot of people to wrap their head around. And you don't think about, like, you know, now I'm a total nerd about, like, glass and, you know, the smoothness of glass. Like, how many angstroms? Like, it's crazy, essentially, like, you know, you have to become almost an engineer, which by no means am I that close to that, but I just was able to build relationships with the right people and the right manufacturers and talk to the right people to be able to make that happen. But it honestly, it took about three years of prototyping, and it took. It, uh, took years to find the right partner to manufacture the glass and do the coatings with also for sake of me not having a ton of capital to put up to start the business. And so doing, oftentimes when you're making a physical product, you have what's called an moq minimum, ah, order quantity, where they want you to order hundreds of the product at a time to start with. But I didn't have 100 grand sitting in my pocket, especially after the pandemic, to get something off the ground. So I really had to find somebody who was willing to partner on it and believed in it, could do it at a much lower scale to sort of test the waters, basically.
Okay, so you basically got so deep into this that you had no way of turning around. And then you, then what I'm hearing is then you've also found a partner to partner or, uh, to help financially kick this thing off the ground that trusted you or trusted the vision they.
More just agreed to do a lower minimum order quantity. They didn't financially, I mean, in a sense, you could, you could say it was that, but they're not, uh, like, I'm the sole owner of the company. They didn't, like, put in cash upfront. They were just willing to do a minimum order quantity that was a lot lower than most of the other manufacturers I was talking to at the time. So, yeah, that was more the process. And also it was a process of like, quality control where I went through, you know, dozens of, I have still to this day, have this big old box of ND filters that didn't make the cut. But, you know, all have various different issues with them. Some have more color shift, some, you know, have the wrong coatings, etcetera. Like there's, you know, went through a lot of testing in that sense of, and just like, educating them on, like, the caliber of what I wanted it to be was honestly a lot of the work beyond just like, finding somebody who could do it at the scale that made it possible.
How did you even begin to find, like, someone to a specific coding? Um, what is it? What is the coding on the front of yours you have.
Yeah. So we make hot mirror ir nds. So essentially what that means for those of you who don't know is like, there's a mirrored surface on one side of the nd filter that isolates and reflects infrared light. So you don't get any infrared light pollution in your footage, which is just one type of. There's many different types of ND filters out there, some of which block infrared and ultraviolet light, which is, you know, just light outside of the visible spectrum that are icy. But some digital cameras can see. I mean, there's, there's a million different ways you can do it. Essentially, the manufacturer that I found that m was the route that made the most sense, um, without going into too much detail about it with them.
Interesting. So what was your, that whole adventure, like, what was the biggest hurdle to? Actually, there's so many layers to building a company. I mean, sure, you can make the physical, go through the prototypes, make the physical product, and it's like, okay, well, then how do I even raise awareness that people might want this thing? Yeah, how did you start marketing it? How do you start connecting with people? Uh, getting things going?
Yeah, I mean, that's still, you know, a tricky piece of the puzzle today, especially now. There's a lot more competition. Like, a big goal of the company was to make the product at a more accessible cost than what else was out there. And nowadays, it's a much more saturated thing. Even fast forward a couple of years from when we launched. And so, yeah, it's more about brand awareness and trust. And with the initial batch, uh, of filters, specifically with the ND's that I made, I essentially just sent them out to ten or 15 cinematographer friends of mine to test as sort of like a quality control, the last step of the quality control process, but also just as like a, uh, let me know what you think about these. Get feedback. Real world, you know, people who are shooting every day and use these things every day, because ultimately, like, I always find the best filmmaking products come from people who work on set and they understand how that works. Just because you're able to translate that into, like, oh, why doesn't do this? Why, you know, why does this cost that much? Why does this function that way? How can this help me do x by z? And I think that really translates to getting that feedback from people who are shooting every day and using it in a real world scenario is super, super helpful.
And, uh, I think I recently saw you coming up with more effects filters. Tell me a little bit about that.
Yeah, so after the nds, we dove into doing a diffusion filter called opaline. Yeah. Just wanted to give DP is one more way to stand out. You know, there's, there's the classic diffusion filters that everyone knows and loves. The glimmer glass, the black promis, the pearlescent, you know, whatever. But nowadays it's all, you know, it's all about giving people, like, how do you create your own style? How do you create, make your work look different and create your own taste? And I think that having just one more option of something you could put in front of the camera is really cool. And at, uh, the same time, um, I'm a big advocate for doing stuff in camera. You know, often with quick turnarounds or, you know, post production conversations. Sometimes you can get caught out of those conversations. And so if you can bake a look into camera, I think that's, like, a wise thing to do. And just committing to a look is just like, I think it's just a better philosophy when you're on set of like, okay, let's do this. Let's, let's commit to this. This is your stamp of approval, so to speak, as a DP.
So, you know, I laugh because it's just like, that's kind of like a little secret sauce of, like, the DP is just like, oh, yeah. Like, you know that something's going to get screwed up down the line from, like, you know, client wants something different in color or, you know, whatever. So you're just trying to, like, bake in as much as you can in camera because you're just like, no, no, no. I meant it to look like this. And I'm, um, not. This isn't going to be a filter. We're going to add in post. We're doing this straight. We're doing this on set, an income change, because this is, this is my look.
Yeah. And there's something to be said about, like, committing to that on set, rather. You know, obviously there's a lot you can do in post, but, like, the way that light bounces off of particles in a filter is ultimately going to affect the image differently than anything you can recreate in post. And just the philosophy of, like, this is how I want this to look and this is my artistic stamp and my artistic decision as a cinematographer. I think there's a lot to be said for that.
Yeah. And I'm a huge fan of creative filters just because I feel more confident as a DP when I see what I'm actually trying to achieve on my monitor as I'm shooting. And I'm like, oh, wow. Yeah, the blacks are more open because I'm using this type of filtration or whatever it might be. And I also am like, oh, that does have a bit of a creative edge, or, you know, whatever it might be. Or, you know, let's, let's un, um, like, this lens is a little too sharp. Let's knock that down a bit with whatever it might be. So I'm, like, a pretty huge advocate of having that type of filtration. Um, just to give it, like, that's an extra 510 percent. But it's like, as the DP, like, that's our job, is the extra 510 percent.
So 100%. Yeah, I couldn't agree more. Yeah, it's just a little bit of your own, a little splash of your own taste in there goes a long way.
Yeah. And ultimately, like, most of the time, the director or the, even the client has no idea. You know, they're just like, oh, yeah, it looks great. Like, they don't. But, uh, for us, it's, it's what we put our stamp on, you know? So I think it's, yeah, it's important. And I recently saw you did or having some sort of a partnership with Condor blue and making the filter filters attached to the actual glass itself. Tell me a little about that.
Yeah, we're super excited about that. Essentially, when we first launched opaline diffusion, it was just the glass filter in a four by five size, as you'd see in other diffusion filters. But I got connected to the owner of Condor Blue at the beginning of this year, and for those of you who don't know, Condor blue makes camera cages and accessories and a lot of metal and electronic pieces. Anyway, we just got to chatting and he really liked the Opaline formula, if you will. And long story short, they created this metal frame that sits around the filter and that's great for many reasons, mostly for handling it. So if you're touching the metal frame, you're not going to get fingerprints on the glass. If you drop it, it's less likely to break. But also it allows the frame to keep the standard size of the four millimeter thickness and the four x 5.65 inches outside measurements. And that allows the glass inside the frame to be 2 mm thick, which makes it way lighter weight, which is really nice. And you can feel it when you hold it side by side. With the traditional glass filter, the weight is very noticeable for sure, which, if you're running a lot of filters, makes a big difference. Yeah. So we collaborated on that product. It's branded with element filters and Condor Blue. So it's a huge opportunity for us because Condor Blue is way more established in the space. Element filters is only just over a year old, relaunched in April of 23, so being able to partner with them and on all the relationships they have with distributors. The collab filter is now available in B and H, which is super exciting. And so, yeah, I'm super excited about the partnership with them just because it opens a lot of doors for us and they bring a lot to the table and just all their products are amazing too. Like, I've, um, now, obviously, with the partnership, I started using a lot of their cages and pieces and they're all super well thought out and, yeah, couldn't sing their praises enough.
Yeah, it's funny, I don't know why. It kind of begs the question is, like, why wasn't that, like, industry standard to have the kind of the frame baked onto the piece of glass? Because the amount of times you're on set and then you have that sketchy moment where you're trying to pull out the filter and you're about to, you know, is your first ac going to drop it or you're passing something or you're putting fingerprints on it. Like, those moments happen all the time, so. Totally.
Yeah, I can see why that's like, actually a very useful thing as well as I never thought about the thinner glass part, because that seems to be coming a theme. It's like, yeah, why would it be 4? It could be two. Save the weight on the front of the lens, which becomes a problem with gimbals, because the more weight on the front of the lens, some of these smaller gimbals just freaking.
Yeah. Pushes the limits. Totally. I mean, you see it all across the industry. You know, people are trying to make cameras, smaller people, you know, it's all about, like, how nimble can we. Can we make this, essentially? And if we can, you know, if you can save a few grams here and there, you know, or cut the weight of it in half, like, that's becomes pretty huge when you add that up on all the different bits and pieces.
Yeah. What's been your favorite part about this whole journey with element filters? Like, is it just, I don't know, flexing a new muscle, perhaps, other than the DP one? Or do you want to just, like, delete the whole project because it was so stressful? Yeah. What. What's been the big piece from that?
I have my days for sure, where I want to click delete. No, it's. I mean, it's been such a, uh, honestly, like, uh, such a good learning process. It's. Launching a physical product is completely different than what I do on the day to day with shooting with as a DP. And there's so many takeaways to be had from that, from, like, a business perspective and an entrepreneurial perspective that have been super valuable in learning. And I think the most rewarding thing, to answer your question, is seeing people use the products in the real world and seeing what they create with them. Like, oftentimes people will, you know, send messages to the element filters Instagram account of, like, things they shot with the NDS or with the diffusion. And seeing the stuff that's, like, you know, nowadays sometimes way better than the stuff I'm DP'ing is super inspiring and cool. And, you know, now we have DP's who are shooting, like, a 24 films who, uh, now are using the filters. And, like, just that sort of seeing something that you created then out in the real world and being used at a level that. That, like, I'm not even at as a cinematographer is super inspiring and cool.
Yeah, that would feel really rewarding to see, like, wow, this was an idea in my head, and I made it into something physical. The world is using it, and creativity is going literally through it, and then I get to experience that back. Like, that's, uh, that's pretty cool. I like that.
Yeah, it's a really fun, fun thing. And, you know, and at the same time, it's, it's a tricky balance, essentially, I started a whole second career for myself, so trying to balance, you know, reaching out to directors and producers and shooting stuff and then also running a filter company. And, like, it's a small enough scale right now where it's me doing a lot of the day to day, and I've subcontracted some people to help out, of course, and, of course, with the manufacturing process, but it's at this sort of awkward teenage phase per se, where it needs a lot of attention, and that can be a tricky time management thing, for sure, at the same time. So there's, there's pros and cons to it. Absolutely.
Yeah. If there's one thing I learned about getting dialed systems and processes, ironically, this podcast is what really helped me because, uh, in the beginning, I don't know. I don't know if I've actually ever shared this on the podcast, but I just, I tried to do it, uh, and I failed. Like, I recorded three episodes originally, one year, and I just tried to do all the editing myself. I tried to, you know, build up the, you know, do the right, you know, the content writing and just blah, blah, blah, blah. And I just got, I was like, I don't have time for all of this. This isn't going to work. I can't be a DP and do this thing. It wasn't until I really stepped back, it's like, well, how do I streamline this and outsource all the pieces that I don't want to be doing? So that's where I built this really extremely dialed workflow in notion, and I outsourced the editing. I have a few people on upwork that I hired the editor for this podcast, actually, in the Ukraine. The person who's writing the content and doing all the art and everything, uh, is in the Philippines. And so it just, like, essentially really tried to strip back and outline all the pieces that needed to be done, created a system for it, and then just allowed myself to be able to jump on the mic with grad people like you and then just focus on that part. But up until then, like, without that, like, year one, this failed super hard. So, systems and processes. Mandy.
Yeah, I mean, do you still to this day, find it tricky to balance even when all, with all those systems in place? Like, what do you do if you have four back to back shoots, and then you're also trying to record podcast episodes and like, post them. And, you know, like, that must be a tricky balance.
Yeah, no, I guess my hack around that and something that I had to have the, like, the flexibility of having the freelancers doing most of the work on this is that I try to batch these. So, like yesterday I recorded a podcast. Today I'm recording a podcast. In a couple days, I'm going to do another one. So then I knock out three or so in a week, and then I release every three weeks. So it allows some bit of bandwidth to, uh, it's like, okay, I batch recorded for one or two weeks and then I have two or three months of content. And then that also gives the post production team time to slowly work on the, uh. Cause it takes them a week to start the edit, then it takes them a week to pass it off to each other and stuff. So my trick has been trying to stay ahead of the game. So it's like, I never feel stressed, I never try to leave myself, like, oh, there's going to be one more, or how do I say, like, I don't have a pod. There's a podcast release day coming up and I don't have one ready. I try to be like two or three ahead of the ball, and that's how I've been able to, like, lower the stress margin on that, so to speak.
Yeah, totally. I mean, that's, that sounds smart. I can only imagine that's a, uh, tricky. Yeah, was tricky to set up, too. You know, a lot of people don't realize the behind the scenes of, like, sure, those systems are in place now, but what did it take you to put that in place? And I'm sure it was a lot of trial and error.
Like you said, I wanted to hit the delete button as well so many times. Um, but I will say for you as well, like you experienced, you said, um, the rewarding part is seeing it out in the world. I too, it's like the DM's. You guys send me on Instagram and just say, like, thank you so much for this, or, oh, this, I took away this nugget or whatever it is. Like, that's what keeps me going. So, yeah, shadow to everyone who's consistently listening and reaching out, I really appreciate it.
Totally. Well, it's so cool to hear, you know, you oftentimes you don't get to hear different perspectives and it's. Yeah. As somebody who's listening to the podcast for a while, it's cool to hear the perspectives of people that you might not chat to on the day to day. And obviously, in an hour long podcast, you get a lot more in depth with stuff, and you hear more than just the surface level of what you might see on somebody's social media. So, yeah, props to you for sharing those stories. It's cool to hear about.
Advice to Newcomers
Yeah. Thank you. As we begin to wrap things up, I don't know, if you look back at yourself, like, ten years ago and you looked at this journey and someone else is sitting there right now, is there anything that you might say to them or stands out? Whether that be your journey as a DP or starting this company with physical products, like, here's Tucker a decade ago. What. What are you telling him?
Uh, honestly? Yeah. I think that the biggest thing that comes to mind is just shoot. Like, shoot, shoot, shoot, shoot. I think that, like, following your passions is, like, too many people are too afraid to do that. And I think if you're able to just ignore that voice in your head that says not to do something because it's not practical or because it's gonna be hard or whatever, is the biggest piece of advice. Like, at that time, just learning the ropes and getting out there with a camera and, like I said, keep shooting would be the best piece of advice I could have given myself ten years ago.
Yeah. Cause ultimately, it comes down to reps, right? Like, I think you mentioned that. It's just like, how else do you get better at building a business? How else do you get better at shooting? It's just like, you screw up over and over, 100% each time you get one, 2% better. So, yeah, I 100% agree with that advice, and it's just keep showing up, keep doing the thing.
Yep. I still do it to this day. So it's. You got it. You gotta keep. Keep putting in the reps. I it's funny when you do this for. For so long and you still feel like you haven't gotten anywhere, you know? And once you look, you know, you look back on the journey and you can see the distance you've made up, but it's. I think as long as you have good taste and, uh, good aspirations for it, I think you'll. There'll be a little bit of an. Always a little bit of a feeling of, like. Like, yeah, room for improvement, which I think is a healthy thing if you can have a good relationship with it.
Yeah. I just feel like the journey is that, like, unknown bit of, like, oh, you know, I think it's I think it's false. Like, one day I'll feel comfortable doing this. Like, honestly, I don't. I don't think so. Like, there's always going to be an uncomfortable element of, like, I don't know where the next job's coming from or. Oh, like, you know, um, I don't know how to level up or I don't know how to meet more people in the right space or whatever it is. I think that's. That's just. That's the journey of what we've chosen, so at least we get to talk about it here on the. On the podcast.
Absolutely. Yeah. And try to have fun with it, is what I'd say. You know, it is a roller coaster, but. And while sometimes they're scary, they're also supposed to be fun. So I try to keep that in mind as well.
I like that. I like that. So, uh, if people want to find you, where can people go?
Totally. Yeah. Uh, I'm on Instagram, obviously, as most DP's are at Tuckerkay Anderson, or if you want to check out the filter company, it's ement filters. And all the links to websites and stuff. Stuff are on those as well.
Awesome. Well, thanks for coming on the show today, Tucker. Really appreciated. Yeah. Just the advice and just, uh, sharing some of your journey story here. And it was a fun chat.
Yeah. Thank you so much for having me.
Okay, that was DP Tucker Anderson. Tucker has such a great energy about him and the way in which he sees the creative business journey to do what he loves for a living. You to check out some of his work on Instagram, Tuckerkanderson, or his website, tuckeranderson.com. or if you're in the market for a new Nd set or filter effects, jump over to elementfilters.com dot in efforts to continually grow this podcast and help you make a living doing what you love. I have a request. I want you to dm me on Instagram arshalchupa and let me know where is one thing you're struggling with most and why is it so painful? Learning what my audience is struggling with most will help me dig deeper in future episodes with other guests and ultimately help all of us grow as a community. In future episodes, I'll be speaking with photographers, cinematographers, directors, producers, reps, and anyone who has decided to take this ambitious leap of faith and making a life and a living behind the lens. Stay tuned and subscribe to the channel and your favorite podcast app. And if you have 30 seconds to leave me a star rating review. I would much appreciate that. If you hear something of value, I encourage you to share this episode with a friend and help them along their creative journey. Thanks for listening and we'll catch you next time on shotlist.
