33. Breaking Creative Blocks and Staying True to Yourself | Sean Tucker Photographer, Filmmaker, Author
In this episode, Marshal interviews photographer, filmmaker, and author Sean Tucker, exploring creative blocks, authenticity, and balancing commercial work with personal passion. Sean shares insights on building discipline, staying true to your vision, and finding direction in the creative journey. They discuss practical ways to handle introversion in a career that often requires extroverted skills, as well as strategies for dealing with perfectionism, social media validation, and envy.
Episode Highlights
03:41 Beginnings in Photography
06:22 Transitioning into a Creative Career
09:38 Finding Your Creative Direction
11:22 Balancing Passion with Profession
16:07 Developing Discipline in Creative Practice
25:13 Facing Creative Blocks
29:16 Managing Social Media and Criticism
32:19 Structuring Creative Projects
42:14 Introversion in a Creative Career
54:30 Final Thoughts and Future Projects
🔗 CONNECT WITH SEAN TUCKER
📸Instagram | www.instagram.com/seantuck
💻Website | www.seantucker.photography
▶️ YouTube | www.youtube.com/@seantuck
🔗 CONNECT WITH MARSHAL
📸 Instagram | www.instagram.com/marshalchupa
💻 Website | www.marshalchupa.com
👥 Linkedin | www.linkedin.com/in/marshal-chupa-99a7921a8
📄 SHOW NOTES & TRANSCRIPT
Visit the website for the transcript and highlights from the conversation - www.shotlistpodcast.com
🎙 ABOUT THE PODCAST
This podcast is all about helping emerging cinematographers, photographers, and directors navigate the challenges of making a life and a living behind the lens. From workflow to personal growth, creative vision to marketing, finances to production—every episode is packed with a wide range of topics to support visual storytellers in their pursuit of building a business and growing a career they are proud of.
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📱 GET IN TOUCH
You can also drop me a DM instagram @marshalchupa or email marshal@marshalchupa.com
Transcript
Introduction and Welcome
Marshal Chupa: Hello, and welcome to another episode of the shot list podcast, where we talk about how to make a life and a living behind the lens. I'm cinematographer Marshal Chupa, and today I'm speaking with photographer, filmmaker, and author Sean Tucker. In this episode, Sean and I dive into some of the biggest creative blocks we struggle with as creatives and how to start to overcome them, the importance of creating work that is authentic to you and avoiding getting caught in the validation trap, how to deal with being an introvert in an extroverted career path, and how to identify some of the hidden parts of ourselves that could be quietly sabotaging our potential.
Sean has a very elegant and inspiring way of communicating the common struggles we all face as creatives, and has been a great source of inspiration for me throughout my early days as a photographer. If you're looking to dive deeper past the gear and the how tos, This episode is for you. Let's dive in.
Sean, thanks so much for coming on the shotless podcast.
Sean Tucker: Appreciate you being here.
Marshal Chupa: Yeah, thanks for having me. So originally, I feel like I found you many, many years ago when I started out my photography journey back when that was my focus. And I think it was kind of you and David Duchemin were probably some of the only people speaking to Lisa that I could find kind of the philosophy or the lifestyle or the mindset.
But the art of kind of the creative journey, I think a lot of people speak to tech and gear lighting, all that kind of stuff. But I was always really excited when I came across your work. I always felt inspired after kind of, yeah, listening to what you're speaking to. And it was yesterday when I was doing a little bit of research that I came across a YouTube series you shot, I think seven years ago, and it spoke very much to that. I'd love to preface this conversation with you down some of those things that it's kind of came across yesterday. But before we do that, I'd love to just get you to introduce yourself and just let everyone know a little bit about who you are.
Sean Tucker: Yeah, my name is Sean. I'm a photographer, filmmaker on YouTube, and, uh, author. And I'm somebody who I don't do a lot of client work anymore. I'm lucky enough that I get to work for myself. So. I'm making work that either tells stories I find interesting, or especially my video and writing, I'm trying to inspire other creative people who, not just photographers, but anyone who makes anything really. To help them get a handle on the creative process and make it a good journey rather than something that's filled with anxiety and worries, which is so common in our modern day. So I guess overall, I'm a communicator. I use a lot of different medium to try and get across the messages that I hope helps.
Marshal Chupa: Yeah. If you kind of like wind it back to the very beginning, how did your journey begin? Speaking to like how you picked up a camera and began that journey, I think, and then slowly built that into making a living, because I think that's very much what people are trying to figure out who are listening is, okay, I love this camera stuff that's, you know, video, photo, directing, how did that journey begin for you in that transition?
Beginnings in Photography
Sean Tucker: I've always taken images. I think even as a kid, I would, I would run around with a little, uh, sort of point and shoot film camera. So I always had that kind of bug and I loved it for myself, but I didn't make it a job for quite a few years. I mean, my, my twenties were spent in Southern Africa working for the church. So, uh, you know, I kind of had a whole other career before this and I parted ways with the church when I turned 30. Specifically in that time, I've been doing a lot of video work, so I was doing things like training videos for corporates on the side of the church job because the church didn't pay very much, or I was doing videos of the city that I was in because I found it interesting, and specifically in Cape Town where there was a lot, in Johannesburg, where there was a lot of poverty and social issues, I was trying to make films there that would sort of get people to pay attention, but it was really on the side, I wasn't getting paid much for doing that work, and not many people saw it other than the events that I used to run. But when I left the church, you know, it was having to start a career from scratch again. So a friend of mine said to me, if you're going to start from scratch, you might as well start with something you really enjoy doing. And that's when I decided, wow, could I actually make this thing that I love the thing that pays the bills? And, uh, it took a long time. I mean, the first three or four years I tried, I was just waiting tables and trying to build a photography business on the side and not, if I'm honest, not getting very far because I hadn't anticipated how much marketing goes into making that work. And I wasn't actually that good yet. I still had a lot of things to learn. My first full time job was with a company in Cape Town called Yuppie Chef, who sold kind of fancy kitchenware online. And I was their in house product photographer and the food photographer for the magazine that they used to put out and made some videos for the YouTube channel. So that was kind of my first professional job as a photographer. And then came over to the back to the UK in 2012 and then it was product photography for a company here for four or five years. And then I went to work for an American consultancy where I headed up the photography and video for EMEA, for Europe, Middle East and Africa. And then I took the leap in about 2018 to sort of work for myself and make work that I could sell and build an audience that I could sell to and do workshops and training and teaching and in the mix of all that, be able to support myself. So it's kind of been a, I suppose, a journey of increments for them.
Marshal Chupa: Yeah. It doesn't sound like freelance was the starting point. I think that's a lot of, at least what I hear is like, people have a completely different job and they want to kind of jump ship, you know, into the thing. But what I hear is you kind of found ways of finding full time work within the industry itself, keeping yourself behind the camera, and then slowly building that kind of muscle or repertoire, is that how it works?
Transitioning into a Creative Career
Sean Tucker: Yeah, I'll be honest. I never made a success of myself as a purely freelance photographer. I never cracked it. I didn't work it out. I'm not embarrassed to say it. I really gave it a good shot. And I think a lot of people relate to that, you know, they have tried everything they've knocked on doors. They've, they've built their skills and got a good offering, but just things don't come together because there's only so much room in the marketplace perhaps, or it's just really tough in some cities. Like I'm not embarrassed about the fact that that didn't work because I, I adjusted and sidestepped and worked out how can I make this work in the aggregate of a few different things without trying to put all my eggs in one basket. And that worked better. And I think that's probably a story that a lot of people share. A lot of people have that similar experience.
Marshal Chupa: Yeah. And it's clear that you obviously have such a skill. I don't know. Yeah. Something that I see in you is just like, yeah, the inspiration and the willingness to be vulnerable and speak to the things a lot of people aren't. And it's clear that that's what you're able to build upon. Because I think in this day and age, we all need that voice and you've kind of showed up and yeah, I just want to like take a minute to thank you for the inspiration over the years that you've put into the community. And myself, I remember watching those videos. And like seven years ago and thinking like, wow, I remember stepping away and, and being like, yeah, like this, this is like, no one else is doing this kind of thing. So I think, you know, ultimately it's cool to hear that life pivoted you into almost helping others along their journey, then getting to stuck into the typical freelance model and plugging away and shooting and grinding. So, yeah. Thanks for all that you've, you've put into the industry so far and into the community.
Sean Tucker: Oh, that's kind man. Thank you. I think for me, it was working out, you know, you can get a camera in your hand and you can build up a set of skills, but you start to decide what you're going to do with it. And where I found, I started to get a bit of traction was where, you know, I'd left the church behind. And the reason I joined the church back in South Africa and started working for them was because I thought I could help people. You know, my, a lot of my work was youth ministry and poverty outreach. And it took me a few years going off and trying to be a photographer and trying to work out how do I make money doing this and it was just career focused and about five years in, I realized, hang on a minute. What if I brought back some of the stuff that I left that I really love doing and applied it to this as well. So yes, I'm a photographer, but I'm pointing the photography and the filmmaking and the teaching that I do. But the same thing I used to do that bring me, that brought me a lot of joy. And I think that's when people latched on to it and go, okay, we'll follow this thing he's doing. Cause that's interesting that there was obviously something to it. And for me, I know that when I find it in other people and I go, I want to follow this, it feels true. Like it feels like capital T true. It feels like. That's who that person is. That's what they have to give. And that's, that's part of the trick. I think if it's purely a commercial exercise, how do I make money with my camera? For me, it was definitely a struggle, but when I brought a lot of myself to it, it became a more unique offering that people seem to pay attention to.
Marshal Chupa: Yeah. I feel that. And that kind of leads into what I'd like to speak to first is just like, how do we pick a direction with our work? I think a lot of people, you know, it's such a common struggle, especially in the beginning. It's like, well, I got to make money. Yeah. To make a living, but I also like, I don't really know what I want to shoot yet. I love camera work, you know, whether that's video or photo, maybe directing. Can you speak to a little bit about, yeah, just finding direction in the beginning?
Finding Your Creative Direction
Sean Tucker: Yeah, I think it's about getting to know yourself. Who are you and what do you have to offer? What do you see in the world that needs paying attention to? What stories do you want to tell? What makes you angry? What makes you sad? What makes you happy that you see out there? If you can start to point your camera at those things, I think you make better work. But I would say. Maybe it's slightly unpopular opinion, like I don't think that's always the commercial decision. It's a difficult thing to do. Like the work that I wanted to make didn't really make much money. I mean, anyone who does street photography will know this. You might love street photography, but you also know if you've tried it for a while, it's a very, very hard medium to make a living in. So you have a choice to make. Do you plow ahead with that? And do you pay your bills another way for a while and see if something takes but still enjoy the process and still make beautiful bodies of work because you love to make that work and you know, your bills are paid some other way. Maybe that's how it has to work for some people. I mean, some of the most famous street photographers were people who actually didn't do it as a job because they couldn't make it work as a financial job, but they wanted to make that work. And then maybe there's another side of your photography where you're being more strategic and you're going at them. Like for me, it was product photography. I don't enjoy product photography. It's not like I got a kick out of it and it was creatively fulfilling, but I knew that people needed product photography and I knew I could do that. So that became the commercial side of what I could offer. But who I am and how I am and what I had to offer was one thing. And the niche I saw in the market where I could go and serve that niche with a skillset was a completely separate thing in my case. I think it's a very lucky few that managed to find that intersection. And the thing they absolutely love to do is also the thing that pays the bills. It's something we should all aim for. But I think we have to get honest and say that it probably takes diversifying for most of us to make it work.
Balancing Passion with Profession
Marshal Chupa: And I think the truth is like, oftentimes the guys you see who are doing quote unquote the work you wish you could do, oftentimes they're doing the toothpaste commercial in the background or whatever it is, you know, and they're not showing that on Instagram. They're showing that the darkly lit, you know, lots of haze, backlight, shallow depth of But we're all making a living somewhow. And you're right. It is the very lucky few at the top who are finding that intersection. And the more and more I speak to people who are at the top, again, there's always the toothpaste commercial and it doesn't matter how high you get up the ranks. And I think the beauty and maybe I'm curious if you agree or disagree is this, you do have to, whatever it takes, find a way to make a living, but then also. Continually come back to the passion side of what you're doing. And I mean, I may be curious to hear about your journey because you said you shot product photography as the means of income, but were you able to still keep passionate about what you're doing? Because oftentimes we can kind of get sucked down a rabbit hole of, well, this is what makes money and this is the thing I do. And then you kind of lose the love for the thing you're actually got into it for.
Sean Tucker: Yeah, there's a real danger with that. I think I get a lot of people talk to me and say, well, you know, my goal is to become a professional photographer. And whilst that's a good goal, I always push back a little bit and say, are you sure you want to do that? Do you know what that means? Because, you know, when I was a professional photographer working full time for a company shooting the products. It's nice to be able to tell people, Hey, I'm a professional photographer, but if you follow me around in my day to day, you would have gone, Oh gosh, not this though. This is terrible because I'd have to go set up, you know, white paper rolls and in dirty warehouses and put multiple lights up in these filthy cold spaces, shooting really ropey sofas for the whole day, like 60, 70, 80 sofas. And then sitting in the office for a week, just cutting them out, putting them on white backgrounds, adding drop shadows. There was nothing romantic about it, but yes, technically I was a professional photographer paying all my bills with a camera. There was a stage where I started to fall out of love with photography because it was only a technical exercise and I had to rescue it for myself and that's when I picked up street photography. So I would get off the train and stop early on my way home and just pull my phone out. I left my fancy cameras in the backpack because I was like, you know, I have mixed feelings about these things now. And I've just used my phone and just photographed intuitively, whatever I saw between the station and home for about a half hour walk to remind myself that I liked the intuitive act of just making things like this. It's not just about making money or the technical side of things. And I think you've got to be really careful, you know, you, you have to guard that love of the medium that you first found and you have to be careful that it doesn't get sucked away. If you go down a filmmaking route or a photography route with what you do that does end up just being serving clients because you know, people who do that sort of work, no, I mean I'm not being overly cynical. I think when I say that most client work, you're being asked to do bad work quickly and cheaply. It's very frustrating to do. I was happy to do it and felt lucky that I could make money with a camera, but I also had to make sure that I was doing the work I love on the side. So make sure I didn't end up hating it and reminding myself what it's supposed to be.
Marshal Chupa: Yeah. And so how did you, I mean, cause I can just relate to that a lot. It's like, how do you keep that creative spark going? You know, you're coming home. I mean, it sounds like your 30 minute walk with an iPhone was a great little way to keep the inspiration going. How did you keep the actual work though? Like the portfolio work that you're passionate about with the DSLR in hand or making portraits that you print on the wall and feel proud of? Like, how are you able to hold that spark alive?
Sean Tucker: I was quite disciplined with it. I think I saw the problem early on and I just, I would build in personal projects. I would carve out time in my spare time when I was doing the product stuff. It was portrait photography. I was really working hard to develop my portraits because I wasn't getting paid for that work very much. Um, you know, the odd student headshot thing here or there or corporate headshot, but not the sort of portraits I wanted to do. So I would be getting online and finding groups of people who wanted headshots or portraits and offering them for free so that I could develop my style on a Saturday or a Sunday when I'm not at work. Because I knew if I don't get disciplined, about expanding my skillset beyond the kind of low bar that my clients are asking for. I'm going to stagnate and the whole thing is going to stall. I'm going to end up hating it. So I really push myself to make sure that I'm always exploring and growing and making work I care about that looks like the work I want to make, not that a client wants to make.
Marshal Chupa: And when you say you kind of developed discipline structure, how did you do that? Like, I mean, is this something I'm putting this on my calendar? I'm shooting every Saturday or I think a lot of creative struggle with that. Like, Oh, I'm not feeling it. Like, how did you develop that discipline to keep flexing that muscle?
Developing Discipline in Creative Practice
Sean Tucker: Yeah. I read a book a couple of years ago and I talk about this a little bit in that and it's the, there's this idea that you need to be careful that thinking inspiration is a feeling. We say it like that. We say, you know, I can't make anything today because I don't feel inspired. But I don't think inspiration is a feeling and I can't remember where the quote comes from but it says something like inspiration will find you working. And that means that I have to choose to start making something even when I don't feel like it. And often, and you'll know this, like sometimes you make your best work on days when you almost couldn't get yourself off the couch, but you talked yourself into it. You went out there. It was a struggle for 20 minutes, half an hour, but then inspiration found you while you were already working and you got excited and you made some things and you ended the day by going, that thing now exists because I chose to make rather than waiting to feel like making. And that's a big difference. So I am quite hard on myself. You know, if I'm serious about being a photographer, I can't only make images on the days I feel like it. I have to make images because it's a discipline and I want to keep growing. I'm building my skillset and that can't just be done based on my mood swings. It has to be more structured than that. So you know, for me it was, I would make sure I'd look at my calendar. You know, I've got this weekend is pretty free coming up. I'm going to make sure I book someone in for some kind of portrait there. And if I'd gone three weeks without doing that, I call myself on it. You say you want to do this, you need to develop. Maybe you don't feel like it, maybe you're tired, but you need to book in just two hours this weekend to do that thing. You say you love to make some progress, even if you don't feel like it, because you're, you're serious. I mean, how are you ever going to become somebody who gets hired for the work you love doing rather than the work that clients want you to do, unless you build a style for yourself and then build a portfolio in that style that clients find attractive. And that, that takes hours and hours and hours of, of work, which you have to choose to approach like a job, not like a hobby that you only do when you feel like it. I think you have to start to take that approach.
Marshal Chupa: Yeah, I can relate to that a lot. And just even with this podcast, like it's and what I can see for the future vision of shot list as a community is like, it's you versus you. It's like you have the vision, you know, you have to hold that. And when you wake up, no one's telling you to go do the thing. And I feel like it's this constant battle myself every day of just like, yeah, Okay, you see the vision, you're the one holding it. You have to get up and do the steps that are actually going to get you there and no one's going to push you. So like, I think it's, it's challenging because as a freelancer, and especially if you've come from like a nine to five or anything like that, or if you went through, I found, I find this often, if you've done a lot of schooling, or they see this other people that you're used to having someone push you, it's like, okay, there's a deadline for the assignment. There's like a due date, or this has to be done at work. And my boss is going to. Keep me accountable to it. But all of a sudden, as a freelancer doesn't exist. And I think there's a piece of that, that I don't know, that self motivation piece is so important. And where did that fire comes from? You know, to do that. You have any tips and tricks around? Like, I don't know, you said you just You're holding yourself to a professional standard, but how do we, how do we do that?
Sean Tucker: Yeah, I don't know. I think it's different for everybody. What motivates you? It comes down to how much you want it. I mean, if, if you're sitting there making excuses not to make, then maybe there's something else to deal with. You know, maybe there's a block there and you have to work out what that block is before you can get back to work. And it's usually a fear, right? It's usually like, I'm afraid that I won't succeed, or I'm afraid that I'll succeed in the wrong way, or I'm afraid I'll be embarrassed because I make work and everyone thinks it's rubbish, so I don't want to share it. Like, we have to identify what the fear is first. Like, what is the resistance? What's keeping you on the sofa? And when you know what that is, and that takes a lot of self awareness, right? To really get to what that is. When you know what that is, you can start to talk to yourself about it. And on those days when you don't feel like making, you can have that little internal conversation with yourself where you can say, Hey, I know what this is. And I talked to the fear. I know, I know what you're afraid of. I know what you're scared of, but we're going to do this anyway, because I really want this. And, and think about that. Like you're not your own fears. Those fears are somewhere in you in there. They're keeping you and they're holding you back and you have to look them dead in the face to be able to get past them. And when you do that, I think that discipline becomes easier because it becomes a dialogue. You know, it's not like I'm just bullying myself. It's like, I'm going to put things in the calendar knowing I might not feel like it, but on the day when I get there and I don't feel like it, I'm going to have that conversation with myself. I know what your fear is. I know you're worried it won't be good or that you're wasting your time. or that people are going to ridicule you for the work that you make. But this is how we get ahead. We risk, we do this, like we get out the door. We try, we try, we try. That's the only way to get forward. So we can self motivate if we know what the fear is that we're motivating against. That's a big part of it, apart from the practicals of, you know, get it in the calendar and, you know, make sure that you're, you're coming up with those projects to build your skill sets and you're, you're educating yourself the whole time and you're getting the right gear in your hand, that the stuff that you can afford, that's going to do the right job. You're watching the tutorials you need to watch, you're researching, you're finding your visual heroes online that are helping you and inspiring you. All those things are good, practical things. But I think more than that, it's, It's face that fear. What is it? Name it. What's, what's your particular fear that's keeping you back from doing that work?
Marshal Chupa: Yeah. I mean, I can definitely feel that. Like what are your flavors of fear almost, you know, I think I know one of mine is definitely like perfectionism. That's ultimately I'm like, Oh man, like if it's not a hundred, you know, I just, I'm, I think I shouldn't do it. It's not worth it. I don't want to create something that I've already made over and over. It's not inspiring. Like I just, I always feel like I have to level up what I've done in the past. And it's like, if I can't level it up. You know, oftentimes in video that often involves a lot of crew and lighting and fancy camera movement, all this sort of stuff. And all of a sudden I'm like, well, I don't have the budget or yeah, to do that or the crew. So I'm just going to not, you know, that's my thing.
Sean Tucker: Yeah. And I mean, that's a control issue, right? That's like, I really relate to perfectionism with you. Like I, that's my big battle as well. And I, I, if I name the fear in me for that, my perfectionist fear is. I'm afraid that if I, I want to be able to make the work that I can put out in the world and guarantee everyone will like it. That's actually what's going on. I'm afraid not everyone will love this thing I made. And if I can't guarantee everyone loves it, I don't want to make it. That's just. Pretending that we have things in our control that just aren't like everything we make, we're going to release it into the world and some people will love it. Some people will hate it. Some people won't care about it and a whole mix in between, right? How could it be any other way? If you think about it, of course, that's the way it is, right? With everything that we make and we have to find the courage to make the thing as best we can with the tools that we have and then find the courage to give it away and say, here we go. And then let go because how many love or hate it? It's not in our hands, like it's not, it's not ours. And that's really helped me. I've, I've been reading the Stoics a lot over the last few years, the Stoic philosophers. And a big part of that is being able to pass and separate out what I can and can't control. And there's so much anxiety that gets lifted when you realize that making work other people think is perfect is not actually our job. Making everyone love what we make is not our job. It's not in our control. Our only job is to do the best work we can with the time we have, the abilities we have, and the gear that we have on hand. That's it. That's all we can do that. There's nothing else is possible. So that's what we have to push ourselves to keep doing. And then the other thing that helps me is thinking about perfection is like an iterative process rather than every project has to be perfect. And I fail on this all the time because I still, I still want everything I make to be perfect, but it can't be. So I tell myself that this is as good as you could make it this time. Now quickly move on to the next thing and make that a tiny bit better. And that won't be perfect either. And you'll be disappointed. You'll look back at it and you'll see the flaws and they'll be staring you in the face and you'll feel like I messed up, but quickly move on and do the next thing and make that a tiny bit better. And then when I look back over the years, I can see how my work now is much, much better than it was 10 years ago. And that's because I pushed myself to make, learn the lessons, put it out as best I could and move on and do the next one and make it a tiny bit better. And it's that incremental process that helps us get good. Not trying to force the one project we're doing right now to be perfect. That's unattainable. And thinking in that kind of longer term.
Marshal Chupa: Yeah, that makes a lot of sense. I just remember like, I think I reposted someone's Instagram story the other day and it's just two people standing in front of a wall and like you know, one has a paint, they both have paintbrushes and one of them makes the first stroke and then the second stroke and eventually, you know, it becomes a painting and the first guy just can't paint. Take the first step. And at the end of it, he's like, well, how did you make such a beautiful painting that was just one stroke at a time. And I think that speaks to, oh, man, it's just such a frustrating process. I think it's just the human process.
Sean Tucker: It is. Yeah.
Marshal Chupa: But yeah, I definitely, I feel that I relate to that. I mean, when it comes to other like fears and blocks that people are hitting walls, what are some of the things you often see coming up with imperfectionism.
Facing Creative Blocks
Sean Tucker: A lot of it is the control thing. Like I said, I think the, the, the need for attention is a big one. I think a lot of us, if we're, if we're very honest about it and I put myself in this camp as well, there's a part of us that makes things because we want validation. We want people to tell us we're worthwhile and that we do good work and people really like it because our self confidence is flagging and it feels good when people tell us we've done a good job. And there's nothing wrong with that. That's, that's how it should be. But when that gets uncalibrated, and we start putting too much weight in things like likes on Instagram as some kind of talent score or subscribers on YouTube, meaning our videos are great or rubbish. Like if there's not enough attention on our work, we shouldn't bother with it. We should shut it down. I think that's a big, big mistake that people, especially around social media are making, especially photographers. You know, I've, I've known photographers who were really talented who quit because they didn't get the response they wanted online. I mean, it's that crippling for some people. So I think getting a handle on a need for validation when we put work out is really important too. That we have to be a little bit more self contained. We have to be a little, we have to have a little bit more self belief and say, I think this thing that I'm making right now is good. And if other people don't agree with me, Maybe that's okay. Maybe I can just keep doing it and pushing and going forward and seeing if I can convince people that, Hey, this is actually worthwhile. I mean, in the book I wrote, I talk about Van Gogh, you know, and say that, you know, he's a painter who's is recognized as one of the most successful, well, one of the, one of the best artists of all time. And yet in his lifetime, he's sold very, very few paintings and no one cared about his work. And he, he came into heavy criticism for the paintings that he was making. And, you know, if he took that approach of, well, people have to love this and I, they have to buy a lot of it or I give up. We would have empty museums for his stuff. It wouldn't exist. He had to be a bit self more self contained than that. And I think we have to do the same. We have to say, I really believe in what I'm doing. We're not saying it's the best in the world. We're just saying, I really believe in it. And I, I want to see more of this work in the world and keep putting it out there and keep growing and keep making it better and be a bit more, you know, Yeah. Just sort of self centered in a good way, you know, not egotistical about it, but like backing yourself. Like I believe this work should exist. That's probably a big one. Like I said, I think perfectionism is a big one. Thinking you control things you can't is a big one. Those are probably some of the important ones. I think another one might be envy. I see a lot of people who are creative, who are envious of the attentional success that other people who do the same thing they do are getting, that they think they deserve. And it sidetracks them, you know, some people will like photographers who are street photographers on Instagram, just get really angry about other street photographers that are getting attention and they shouldn't be, and they get upset about it and start kicking off about it. And they make less work and start doing more and more complaining because they get sidetracked thinking it's a competition instead of making their best work and letting what everyone else run their own race, because it's not really their business. Just make your work. You I think it's another pitfall that people fall into. Yeah. A great one for this. In fact, I'm sure you've heard of it, but there's a book by Steven Pressfield called The War of Art. which is a really worthwhile book to go and dig through because he talks about resistances, which he defines as anything that keeps us from making. And he goes through this book listing all sorts of resistances, self doubt and procrastination and fear of failure and all sorts. And it's, it's a really worthwhile one because I think you'll relate to a lot in there if you, if you're struggling with this stuff.
Marshal Chupa: And I think like the social world we live in now is like a blessing and a curse. You know, it's like if back in the day you're shooting film and printing and developing, like there's no instant gratification as well as how are you comparing yourself until someone's printing it or publishing it.
It's just, it's such a different world. You know, we're constantly just consumed by so much work and so much high quality work as well. How do you find yourself battling that? Do you resist or do you have any limitations on like how much time you spend on social or whose work you're looking at or who you're following or anything like that that helps keep you in line?
Managing Social Media and Criticism
Sean Tucker: I think I've come to a good place with it now. I think I did battle with it at the start. You know, I took things very seriously. If people came around trolling, I took that very hard, uh, criticism, you know, that kind of thing. But I think now I make it, I do a good job, I think of curating my feed that comes down. I just try to fill it with inspiring photographers and I don't feel any jealousy or competition with them. I just, I just, enjoy looking at what they do. And it fires me up and makes me think I can push myself further. So I think I've got the competition side of things in my head better than I had it, which is good. I don't worry too much about the responses I get on my own work now, positive or negative, by the way, I think it's important to balance that, like, because I don't know who's giving that feedback. Like, I don't know if they know what they're talking about. And I don't know if they care about my journey, in which case, how seriously should I take that? This goes back to like me taking criticism badly. I used to kind of, if someone would get on an image that I post on Instagram and say, this is rubbish, you know, I don't know why people pay attention to this, feel the need to kind of push back and argue about it, you know, to kind of prove a point or something or back myself. But I had a day where I realized when I posted something back to somebody, I just felt icky about it. I felt gross about it. And I had to think about it. I thought, who am I actually responding to here? I don't know who this person is. It could be a 15 year old, right? Who's living at home with his mom and dad and has mental health issues. And I'm not intellectually bullying this kid in front of my audience because by, by like kicking off back at him and saying, Oh, you don't know what you're talking about. Your, your works are great. I think I'm going to carry on the way. What am I actually doing that? Like it's, I'm embarrassing myself. Just let it go. Like it doesn't matter. You know? And so now I'm quite liberal with the use of the hide user from channel button or restrict user. I don't know if you're familiar with this, but. Basically, if someone posts on Instagram and they're just leaving trolly stuff that you can tell is super negative and rude, and they just want attention for it, I just hit restrict user and it hides the comment from everybody except them. So they can still see their comments sitting there, but nobody else can. So it doesn't give it oxygen, you know, because I think a lot of people post that stuff so that, you know, they go, who's this person with this strong opinion, I'm going to look at their work. And that's the attention they want. They want attention for their own stuff. They want some, some oxygen with it. So it's a great way to kind of kill the oxygen and just let it hang there. You know, I can still see it. They can still see it. I'm not going to respond to it and I've hidden it from everybody else. This just seems a good way to kind of deal with it.
Marshal Chupa: Yeah. I like that. I didn't know that was a feature. So that's, that's cool. And when it comes to creative projects, let's say you want to get into something new, you're feeling you want to, you know, Get re inspired, like what's kind of your process around, I don't know, you talked about making like portrait series and things like that, like if someone is kind of stuck and they're like, man, this podcast has inspired me right now, where do I start with like, kind of like kicking, getting the energy going again and creating some, I guess, structure around a process to create a body of work.
Structuring Creative Projects
Sean Tucker: Yeah, I do the same thing for across the board, really. So I always have, uh, some sort of um, list going for anything. So at the moment I'm putting out two magazines a year called, called Parable, for example. And those magazines are photography and writing around a theme. So what I do, and I've put four out so far, but on my desktop, I've got 40 or 50 folders with title ideas or theme ideas for future magazines. And what I'll do is I'll look through my images every now and again, I'll start dragging images into those folders that might fit with those different themes. And when it comes time to putting a new magazine out, I'll go and have a look in those folders and think, which, which one of these have already got quite a lot of strong images in them. And then I can maybe go shoot a few more and add to that body. And then I've got enough to put the magazine together. Then I'll do the writing and then I'll sequence the images based on where it fits with the writing. So that's that kind of process. And it's the same for the videos on the YouTube channel. You know, I'll, I'll have a list again, just like those folders. I'll have lists of video ideas, things that are possible ideas for the future. And then when it comes time for the next video, I dive into that list. And I go, which one of these is kind of percolated in my brain long enough, and I've got the right things in place to make this or say something good about this now, because maybe when I put it on the list, I wasn't ready yet, but maybe when I go back to it six months later, cause it's time for the next video, I'm like, no, that that's the next one. I'm ready for that one now. So having the kind of lists of possible future things that I'm slowly chipping away at, or just keeping in front of me the whole time, I find super helpful. And then also when I'm out kind of photographing in the day to day. I've got those folders sort of swimming around in my head. So I might walk around a corner and and say I put together a folder that just said Uh, post boxes, for example, right? It's like an idea. Could I do something cool around post, red post boxes in the UK? And then I walk, I'm walking around and I might see a red post box and normally I wouldn't pay attention to it, but I've got red post box in my head as a potential folder for a future project. And I'm like, hang on a minute. I'd normally walk past this, but is there something cool I could do with this visually that might fit in that magazine one? So having those. lists of ideas that I'm adding to and playing with mentally when I've got a free moment or, or trying things out when I'm making means when it comes time to make, I've got these banks of ideas that are kind of ready to go rather than having to come up with something from scratch every time, which I find much harder.
Marshal Chupa: Yeah, that makes a lot of sense. It's like creating different buckets, creative buckets. And yeah, I think there's something to be said, like you're not showing up to a blank page. You know, you, you have a few strokes on different canvases and you're like, well, which one is pulling me. In what direction today? And I think, yeah, there's something beautiful to be said for that. That's kind of a cool idea like that.
Sean Tucker: I'm a big fan of mood boards as well. When it comes time to doing that, having a mood board. So for example, I did, I did a project years ago about shooting three mentors of mine, portraits of three mentors of mine back in South Africa. And so on the wall next to my computer, I had 70, 80 different portraits with some of them were photographs. Some of them were paintings. And I had little color codes where I'd stick different colored stickers next to each as a key. So yellow might be for, I like the lighting and all the yellow ones without like the lighting would have little yellow dots next to them and that like blue might be expression on the face. So all the blue ones would have expression and green might be background texture or color or colors in the image. So that would go. And then I can look at that mood board as a whole and see in the aggregate of those images and the aggregate of the things I'm responding to, that's my target. So I find that really helpful. I use shot deck, which is a great sort of, uh, website where I can build the same mood boards that teach me about cinematography. How can I take better shots? And you can kind of search on those and create your own boards around, you know, I want to select in the, in the filters, daylight, medium shots with yellow, lots of yellow in the color. What have different cinematographers done with that mix of things? How could I learn lessons from what they've done? So, mood boarding things is very helpful as well.
Marshal Chupa: And it sounds like you do it both digital and printed. I totally relate to that. It's just like, yeah, you can get, obviously it's so much easier to work digitally, but ultimately there's something about physically touching something, putting on the wall, looking at it, that's different and important. So, I mean, I'm a little bit nerdy with processes and systems. When it comes to these buckets, you can just mention folders on your desktop. Very simple. When it comes to jotting notes and organizing that, kind of like process for videos. What does that look like? Is it as simple as just like Apple notes or is there something more elaborate?
Sean Tucker: Just Google docs. And when I'm starting with a video, I will, I use the same process that I use when I preach in churches. Funny enough, it's that same communication style. So I basically use this idea of, you know, tell them what you're going to tell them, then tell them in about three points and then tell them what you just told them. Right. So I'm, I'm basically giving an introduction. And I'm trying to make you in that first 30 seconds. I want you to care about what I'm going to tell you. I have to hook you in. So I'm often going to do that with a story or some little anecdote up front that says this is something we relate to. And if I can get you to lock in in that first 30, 45 seconds. You go, yeah, actually, I do relate to this. I'm going to give this time, then I'm going to take you through three points, probably roughly three points, which also unpack this point that I'm making. And then in the, in the outro, I'm going to apply what I've told you to you. So I'm going to try and say, you know, I'm going to wish you well on this issue. I just put out a video on. On imposter syndrome was the last one I put out. So, you know, at the end of that video, I'm saying, if you're struggling with imposter syndrome, I want you to think about this in the ways that we've talked about. You can get over this. It doesn't have to cripple you. I'm trying to apply it personally to your life and your journey rather than just leave it as a, as a nebulous idea hanging in the air. So when I opened Google docs, Title at the top what the video is roughly going to be about and I'll just do intro one, two, three, outro. And then I have to start filling those out, writing about what I want to say in each of those. And I don't write a script. To be able to read from the script when I'm filming, because I think you'd see that I'm reading that wouldn't feel right. So I'm doing it. And so these bite sized paragraphs the whole way down, I'm writing it to make sure that the flow of ideas is good and I'm not repeating myself too much. And cause I'm not just someone who can turn a camera on and talk and hope it sounds slick. I need to prep it. But when I actually do the filming, I'm just, I've got the script and I'll sort of read a paragraph and I'll put it away and I'll just say it two or three times and pick the best one. And it's not about remembering the wording. I want you to see me thinking about the wording while I'm saying it. I want it to feel conversational, but I kind of know where I'm going with that point. That's kind of the balance I have between prepping with a script, but not using it. So it feels too, too scripted and read. That makes sense.
Marshal Chupa: That makes sense. And then obviously, because you're mainly teaching things, ultimately, you just kind of pick a location to film said lesson. And that's kind of is what it
Sean Tucker: I have different buckets of videos I make. So One is, you know, where I'm just sitting on a couch and talking you through something, which I try and make feel like a late night chat in my lounge. So that's always in the same spot. I've got tutorials, which I do, which will be a mix usually of shooting somewhere at either out in the streets or in my studio, and then maybe cutting to editing stuff, which is screen capture on, on a computer. And then the intro outro will just be in my lounge or somewhere in my house, just to sort of. Uh, speak to the camera for a little bit in it. And then the other bucket is doing the documentaries I do. So I go out and I film with other photographers about their process and their journey, which will be traveling to wherever they are, sitting them down and filming a, you know, usually one to two hour interview with them that I've got to cut down to about 15 minutes. And then going out with them and shooting a bunch of B roll of them actually doing the work that they've been talking about to make it more visually interesting. And then again, I'll get home and film the intro outro at home myself talking to camera to just sort of set the scene with it and do a bit of marketing on their behalf. So. Each has a slightly different formula and approach with those three sort of groups of, of videos. But yeah, it's, it's, it's all kind of the same thing.
Marshal Chupa: Yeah. I always love knowing people's processes. So something like, I don't know for myself, as I figured my own out over the years, like right now I'm using Milanote. I've already. Pre written our script, you know, not script rather, but just like bullet points, the main points I want to hit with you and the main topics. And I'm just like scrolling through it slowly. And it's just like the thing I did in the beginning and I've been done every single episode. And it's just, yeah, once you have a, I think there's just something to be said for finding your system and your flow and whether that's being a photographer, cinematographer, director, like I often like, I love meeting other people and just unpacking that because it. Everyone has a different system and like, even especially meeting some directors, they're completely disorganized, but the disorganization somehow has a system, you know, it's like, Oh, this is how they always do it. It's like in these three or four different apps and they look at it in a certain order. And yeah, it's, I don't know. I love that. It's fascinating.
Sean Tucker: Some people need the chaos as well, don't they? Like it gives me hives, but some people love like being a little bit unhinged because they feel like that surfaces new and interesting ideas. I'm a little bit more prepped and controlled than that. But yeah, I think you have to work out who you are and how you work and what you respond best to. What's, what's your way of kind of prepping and getting into things that gets the best out of you, I think is, that's good.
Marshal Chupa: And I want to swing our conversation just a little different direction here, but specifically speaking to, you know, the introvert, extrovert energy. I think as creatives, we, I think some people are, we're just born differently. And uh, I definitely find myself in the introverted camp and yet here I am with a podcast. So go figure. I think you can relate to that. I know I've heard you speak to it. You know, you're here making videos and pushing out content and being in front of the camera all the time. And what are your thoughts and feelings about, you know, I think a lot of people in being artists fall in the introverted camp and get frustrated watching extroverts excel. And I just wanted to speak to that a little bit.
Introversion in a Creative Career
Sean Tucker: I think one of the common misconceptions with introversion, just to say up front, because I think this is important, is people confuse introversion with confidence. So they say, well, extroverts are much more confident and put themselves out there and introverts are much more shy. I think confidence and shyness are a separate issue from introversion and extroversion. So I think you can have a confident introvert just like you can have an insecure extrovert and you probably know both of those, right? Like I would consider myself a fairly confident introvert. The best definition I heard about introversion extroversion is it's more to do with how you recharge so extroverts when they recharge, they've had a tiring week, they want to go out with their friends. They want to hang out with people and sort of get that energy back being around. people who, who, you know, there's a vibe and that gives them energy back. An introvert wants to go home and have a quiet night watching movies and eating ice cream on their own. That's how they get energy back. Right? So that to me makes sense because I can be out in the world and I can make videos and I can go and do talks and I can do that with some confidence and put myself out there in those situations. But I know how I need to recharge is I need to take a lot of time on myself to get that energy back. That's why I know I'm an introvert. I do talks a lot and I, you know, a part of the talk is often, you know, about this introversion extraversion thing. And people will say afterwards, like you said, you're an introvert, but you don't seem to be when you talk. I'm like, that's, I think that's a misunderstanding of what introvert extrovert is. So, I think if you're somebody who says, I'm a creative person, but I struggle to put myself out there because I'm an introvert, I would challenge that and say, maybe think about that definition. Maybe it should better be, I'm a creative person. I struggle to put myself out there because I'm shy. And actually that's a different problem to solve. So the best example I have in my life was when I was, uh, going to go and join the church, work for the church. Part of working for the church is obviously. Being able to speak in public, you can't get away from it. It's a big part of the job, but I used to be terrified of talking in public. I really used to hate it. Even doing like English oral exams at school, we had to talk for 10 minutes and the class had to listen to you and you got a grade for it. I would, I would be shaking. I was so scared of that, but I went to seminary and they, they had this kind of like exposure therapy way of getting it out of you. We had homiletics classes, which were literally like preaching classes. And what they do is you would have to prepare a message. But you would stand up and you'd speak for 45 minutes. And then everyone would go out for a break and you'd come back in and then for the next 45 minutes, the whole class would just rip to shreds what you just did. So you know, you hold your hands weird. You told that story you told, I didn't believe it. You make weird faces. I, I, it was too short. You were too waffly, all sorts of things. Right. And you weren't allowed to justify any of it. You just had to listen to what they were saying, right. And take it in and think about it. And the first class like that was torture. I hated it. I got home and I almost quit. I thought I can't do this, but then I thought to myself that the good I could potentially outdo in the world outweighs the discomfort I feel about this. And I made a choice and it was kind of a brutal choice myself that I want to be able to do this. And I'm going to have to deal with that shyness and discomfort and push into it and see how far I can take this thing. And then I found myself years later, it did take years, but years later finding that I could actually enjoy. speaking in public. I now really get a kick out of it. I like doing it. I'm still an introvert. I still need to go home and recharge on my own or take some days off and get that energy back. But I got over the shyness by, by putting myself out there a bit, if I'm making sense of that difference.
Marshal Chupa: Yeah. I 100 percent resonate with that. And I feel like I land in the, you know, introverted camp energetically and, but I'm also can be confident and just outward, you know, with whomever I'm speaking to. And yeah, I'll be honest, like after, after every time, after I finished these podcasts, like I have this, like, drained energy feeling. And I'm like, Ooh, okay, I got that. Like it's done. I need to go for like an hour walk or something and take a breath. And I've done this thing for many years. And I don't know if it's just a me thing, but like every quarter or something, like I'll just book two or three days and I'll just, uh, for me, it's just like going camping somewhere maybe out of reception ideally. And, um, just really getting away from it all. And like, I find that when I view that as an Introvert because I feel like I describe myself as an introvert trapped in extroverted lifestyle, you know, with everything that's going on, you run a business, you know, podcast, you know, you have big social groups, whatever the heck it is that little like three day two to three day reset. Wow. Like that's sometimes just you lay under the stars. You remember you're just a human being on a planet, having an experience, you get away from all the, all the stuff and all the social and just everything. And it's just, yeah, come back really aligned. So do you do anything like that?
Sean Tucker: Oh yeah. Like I, and I think that's something introverts need to pay attention to is, is how are you making enough time for that? Cause you'll burn out without it. So I regularly go on walks. It's like kind of my little micro holidays. It's like, I could just take an hour walk somewhere in the day. Just helps me decompress and think. And I always come back with more energy from those walks. Then they take from me because it is like time alone headspace. That's really important to do those little things as regularly as I can. And then a couple of times a year I will try and go on retreats, which is, you know, a few days away where I'm just, you know, I'm not there to make work or achieve anything or be productive. It's nothing time. It's downtime. It's getting energy back time. And yeah, I'll often have ideas on retreats. My book came from being on a retreat is where the idea. You know, I started sketching it out, but I wasn't there to do that. I was there to take space. And that's, That's I think something introverts need to make the time and be very deliberate about if they want to make it in the long term and not burn out.
Marshal Chupa: Do you schedule this in ahead of time? Because I think this is something I struggle with. It's just like, I feel like I wait almost too long before I need it. And then it's like more of a like a force thing versus a preemptive like, Oh, you could just actually plan this in your schedule.
Sean Tucker: Yeah, I do. I do. I mean, I used to have this thing when I was in London, like when I went freelance myself, the kind of top and tail of every day used to be commuting on the train. So what I would do is I say, when everyone else is commuting, I'm going for a walk, and that was scheduling it in and it didn't take any extra time because I used to do that commuting thing. So I'm just taking the time that used to be used for that to, to make space for myself. And yeah, I try and schedule those retreats sort of a couple of times a year and spread enough apart. Especially if I can see like a busy block coming up, like You know, I just got back from the States where I was there for, uh, three and a half weeks doing some talks and everything else in July, uh, July, August. But anyway, so, so that was me having to pay attention to, I'm going to be doing this. That's going to take a lot of energy from me when I get back, I need to take a few days and really sort of build that back in. So that was easy to schedule. I knew when the talks were, I knew it was going to be a bit taxing. So with that, I'll then schedule the break afterwards to kind of to get that energy back.
Marshal Chupa: Yeah. And speaking to that time off, are there anything that you do for like health, health and wellness, mental health? I don't know. Like just breath work, meditation. Are you into just kind of like, yeah, I don't know. Long walks. This is how it sounds like is the ticket. Yeah. What kind of things have you implemented to help calm the mind and just kind of come back to self?
Sean Tucker: Walks are a big one for me for sure. It's probably the biggest one for me. I mean, it's where this idea of pilgrimage came from, you know, taking a long walk somewhere. It's not even necessarily about the destination. It's just being out in the world, walking and contemplating and thinking about life and allowing your subconscious to do the processing. So that's a big one. I try and do like a little quiet sit every morning as well, you know, before everything gets started, before the emails, just sit somewhere and just listen to some music or read something or just to, just to quieten down. So those are kind of practices too. I've never been too much with kind of very structured meditation. I like something that's just, I mean, I guess it is meditation, right? I mean, making that space, what else is it? It's just not, I'm not saying a mantra or anything. I'm just making the space to process, which is I think ultimately what meditation is about. It's allowing that internal churning to happen that, you know, let the thoughts get thrown up, move them aside, let the subconscious take over and start to do some of that processing. So yeah, that, that kind of practice of space is a, is an important one for me.
Marshal Chupa: Yeah. Everyone's got their things, but it's been a new thing for me where I've found, um, just been getting into breath work a little bit. And I find that I'm just such like a wound up energetic, or I get wound up energetically. And the way to get myself out of my head into my body is often through breath and kind of so I feel like a circuit breaker where I can just be like, you know, at the end of a workday or, or even directly in the morning, I've developed a morning routine. Now it's just like 5 to 15 minutes, whichever it is, and it's just. You know, which sounds like for you kind of more the quiet meditation piece, but for me, it's almost my body needs a hard circuit breaker jam to be like, okay, get out of the thoughts and back into the body and like be in this present moment again.
Sean Tucker: That's so healthy, man. That's really good.
Marshal Chupa: Yeah, it's something to always be exploring something I would encourage listeners to always explore for themselves because man, I just look back at the beginning of how I started this career and how caught up in my head it was and how you, I mean, there's never an off switch and maybe that's something I'm curious if you have an off switch at the end of the day because I just started, like, is it like, you know, the shutdown process like because you can never stop and I've been getting caught up in this because it's like a delicate balance because like you can be in creative flow. And you can just get so much done and then you can do a hard off and then be like, okay, I'm taking days off or is it like, okay, from nine to five, I'm going to plug in fully. And then I'm actually going to shut off computers, shut off devices and be present with whomever my partner, my kids, my friends. Like, do you have any hard rules with yourself around that?
Sean Tucker: Yeah. It's hard, especially when you freelance because when you work in a standard sort of nine to five job, you know what the hours on are and you know what the hours off are. So I think maybe you have to get a bit disciplined with that too and sort of saying to yourself, you know, I'm not always good at it. Honestly, I can find myself at 10 at night still sitting at the computer and I know it's not healthy. Um, so I constantly have to come back and call myself on it and start to separate out it. When I'm working and when I'm taking space and when I'm doing something that's nothing to do with work, but just gives me back something, it is a constant struggle, but I'm aware of the problem more than I've ever been. So I think that's a good start. And then it is maybe just making those hours for yourself. And if you have to overwork and do overtime because something needs to get done, which you all have to do. And you take time out of the next patch to give you something back. You know, you can't, you can't keep burning the candle at both ends. You know, you have to balance it or you won't be in it for the long haul.
Marshal Chupa: Yeah, actually, I mean, just to speak about nerdy processing systems, I just started using this app, SunSuma, SunSuma, something like that. This weekend, it has like, in the morning you arrive, you have all your to do lists, you kind of pick what you're going to do. It builds it. Puts it right into your calendar and kind of breaks out into time blocks for you. But that the feature I like is at the end of the day, you set like, what is your end time? So like yesterday, 5pm, it warns me, hey, you're coming up on your five. And then at the end, it kind of just pops up and says, And it's just like, I'm like, Oh, this is like, I think I actually should stop no matter like if I'm in the flow and this has been a lot of screen time today. And then it looks and then gives you a review of your day. This is what you can accomplish. There's so much time it took. And then you can kind of like type final notes of the day and then hit shut down. And like there's something, something so I don't know. It's almost like if you worked a nine to five, that's how it would actually work. But in freelance. We don't have that. So I don't know. I've only played with this tool for a week now, but I'm definitely liking that nudge.
Sean Tucker: Sounds great. Yeah. Because you can't get just lost in it, right? You can be there working and you haven't, you don't even aware of the time. So having an alarm or an app or something that's to hold you accountable for the hours you said you'd work, it's any help by that. I think.
Marshal Chupa: So just as we begin to wrap things up, is there anything that's like really firing you up these days, projects and things you're working on?
Final Thoughts and Future Projects
Sean Tucker: I'm really excited about the, the kind of, I had, I had this thing I used to do where I, where I put out a book of photography every year that would just sort of 90 images of whatever I saw in the year. And then I wrote this book in 2021. So they're kind of very separate things. It was kind of the photography books and the writing books, you know, so doing this, these magazines twice a year now is now my opportunity to try and grow up as a photographer a bit and pair. These two things, the writing and the images together in better sequencing to tell stories and talk about important things. So the last couple of years they've been really great to do because it's kind of, it's kind of felt like, you know, bringing all those kind of strings of your bow to communicate one thing better than either one could on its own. And that's, it's a great challenge and it's got me fired up about what can I use this for? Like what other things could I be talking about? And that's, it feels like the next step. You know, it was growth as a photographer, not to just make single images that people like, but to make bodies at work with words that talk about things that I think are important. Like that's kind of projects I'm kind of enjoying the most at the moment is that output. Yeah. And then the videos are just carrying on. I'm always looking for ways to kind of refine and talk about different things. And I think I'm getting a better idea of what my channel is and what it has to offer. And it means it's more niche than a lot of other people's channels, but I like that. I'm okay with that. You know, and I think leaning into that and being more deliberate about making those little documentaries that don't get watched as much as some of the other stuff, but I love making them because I get to be a filmmaker. You know, I'm not, I'm not on camera in those. I'm. I'm filming somebody else and telling their story. Like I, I really enjoy making films about other people. So that's, that's a real joy as well. Those, those two things probably the most, and then I'm also kind of working on a new book slowly. Um, quite a long way of putting it out, but that's also been like a new exercise and something totally different. Yeah. It's nothing to do with photography or creativity or anything like that. It's really something new, uh, for me anyway. So it's, that's been a cool process to kind of dig my teeth into something brand new.
Marshal Chupa: You said you had one book already. What's that one?
Sean Tucker: So it came out in 2021. It's called The Meaning in the Making. And it's basically a, my philosophy for the creative life. So it's not for photographers only it's for filmmakers and writers and painters and poets and any kind of artists, musicians. And it's kind of trying to take you through, you know, what I think creativity really is, why human beings are driven to do it. And then how to do it well so we don't burn out, how we find our creative voice, how we, how we get inspiration, how we deal with things like our need for attention or envy and how we build meaning into the things that we make and, and make them more meaningful for the audience who experiences it. So it's been the thing for me probably that's, it's like the biggest legacy thing I've done. I think it's the thing I've made that will, that stands the best chance of living after I die one day, you know? So it was a really cool thing to kind of put down. And put out into the world and, uh, yeah, I mean, that's kind of what I go around and do a lot of the talks about and stuff as well. So it's been really rewarding and the way people have kind of responded to it has been really moving. Actually, a lot of people have kind of really latched onto it and it's, it's helped people and that, that obviously feels good to have it get people where they're at and make a real difference has been, has been really gratifying.
Marshal Chupa: Yeah, I bet. And if people want to go to find that book or find these magazines, where do they go to find that kind of thing?
Sean Tucker: Yeah. Amazon or wherever you buy books, you can find the Meaning in the Making. And then, uh, the magazines parable, which I, which I put out, it's just on my, my website, SeanTucker.Photography.
Marshal Chupa: And then other places people go to find you Instagram, YouTube, what are those handles?
Sean Tucker: Yeah, Instagram is just Sean Tuck, S E A N T U C K, and if you just put, oh, it's Sean Tuck as well on, on, on YouTube. If you just do youtube.com/SeanTuck, you'll find my channel or just Sean Tuck. If you search me, you'll find me.
Marshal Chupa: Awesome. Well, thanks so much for your time today, Sean. Really appreciate this conversation. And, um. It will have you back someday, too.
Sean Tucker: Great, man. Thank you. Yeah, it was lovely to chat.
Marshal Chupa: Okay, that was photographer, filmmaker, and author Sean Tucker. Sean has a way of really pulling on the heart and soul of the struggles we truly go through as creatives, and his vulnerability and willingness to speak to the depth is something I truly appreciate. I encourage you to check out his YouTube and Instagram channel, both under Sean Tuck, S E A N T U C K. And you can also check out the paper book and audio book he mentioned The Meaning in the Making on his website, SeanTucker.Photography, an effort to continually grow this podcast and help you make a living doing what you love. I have a request. I want you to DM me on Instagram @MarshalChupa and let me know what's resonating with what you're hearing and what do you want to hear more of? And if you have any guest recommendations, I'm all ears. In future episodes, I'll be speaking with photographers, cinematographers, directors, producers, and reps, and anyone who has decided to take this ambitious leap of faith and making a life and a living behind the lens. Stay tuned and subscribe to the channel on your favorite podcast app. And If you heard something of value, I encourage you to share this episode with a friend and help them along their journey. Thanks for listening and we'll catch you next time on Shotlist.
